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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
When it comes to car stereo, I know next to nothing. Bring me your medical problems and I will help you, but car stereo and RMS and all this stuff is kind of overwhelming.

My question is with RMS. I want to put 6x9's in the back, and I have settled on either the Polk MMC690's or the DB690's. Problem is that both of these speakers are 100W RMS and my factory deck is only 30W RMS (if I'm lucky). If I were to get these 100W RMS speakers and DID NOT AMPLIFY, will they still SOUND good? In other words, will I get the full range that the speakers were meant to put out, or will I have to amplify in order to do any good?
 

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your head only pushes out (i think we settled on this) about 20 watts rms per channel. Im not an electrician, but if your splicing into the speaker level without amplyfying it, simply put, its not good at all. You won't get the performance you would with $150 amp. You could even damage your speakers because you are under powering them. It is ALWAYS better to match your speakers up with an amp that can handle a little more power than the speakers.
 

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Ok I understand you want to put 6X9s on the rear deck.
Do you audiophile system or stock??
Are you adding 6x9s or replacing stock factory??

Better yet, what are you trying to gain from this audio upgrade?? More bass? More/louder sound?? What music you listen to?

Help me to try and help you. Feel free to PM me for any questions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
pkoko - I don't have the audiophile system. I have nothing back there right now. I think I'm going to add some 6x9's though, but I will NOT replace my factory deck (this isn't because of ME, it's because of the other 50% that I'm married to).

It's nice that she's letting me put speakers in the car, so I'm not complaining. That head unit really isn't bad. It's better than most of the entry non-OEM crap they sell at Best Buy or Circuit City.

I want to run 6x9's back there, but you have pretty much already told me that I will need to amplify anyway. I am thinking about getting some Boston Acoustics 3-way speakers because to me they seem like a much better fit for my needs. They are 45W RMS, but peak power 140W. What amp would you suggest for this?

I'm going to upgrade the units in the doors to 2-way Boston Acoustics with 35W RMS with 120 peak. I was not planning on amplifying these, but do you think I would need it?

If so, please give me suggestions on what amps to buy!!! Thanks
 

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Well for starters, forget anything named peak watts. For chosing interior speakers (not subs) rms rating is irrelevant as long they are in 25+W from reputable brand (I love Boston Accoustics; Polk Audio sounds close but easier to find esspecially at CC). The front are 5x7s and I tried polk db570 and was impressed with them. They sound great of stock headunit and amp as well. I ran them with around 70W RMS of an amp obviously and sounded great and did not distort at all. definatley well worth $$. http://www.crutchfield.com/S-D87VrbEQ0D5/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=51900&I=107DB570

you still didn't tell me what are your audio goals? clearer sound? louder? more bass? Do you want a sub??

Do NOT add full range 6x9s back there. That will cause all the sound to come from the back. If you still want to do it just try moving the fader 2/3 way back and see it you still like the music. I guarentee you won't. We like music infront of us not behind us.

If you still want to add 6x9s; get some with the smallest tweeter and best bass response and don't run them full range (all the frequencies). run them as subs just for the lows. In my experience Kicker 6x9s have the best bass response out there. Also think of solution to cover the speaker cutouts. To drive 6x9s you will need an amp. I will discuss that below.

So I will give you what I would do based on the following:

Clearer sound:
Replace only the front speakers with 5x7s. Make sure you disconnect the stock tweeter( near power mirrors ) otherwise the highs will be too much. if you don't listen louder than max 2/3 of your radio then an amp is not needed. An amp will make them play louder and probably clearer but you need to decide if you need it.

Louder?? Not a lot of bass.
upgrade all 4 interior door speakers and get a 4 channel amp to power them all. This is in my opinion one of the most cost ineffective upgrades because in good stereo 70% of sound should in front of you. Trust me this upgrade is not needed without a sub. I don't reccomend this.

More Bass: you have 2 options: Option A is preferable by large margin.
A) Add a sub. even a small one is a great improvement. I would reccomend 1 10" or 12" sub given around 100-200W RMS from an amp obviously. Make sure you go for a sealed box as they sound better and take less space. I reccomend this loaded enclosure: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-D87VrbEQ0D5/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=510&I=700BSTPK1

B) do what I told you about 6x9s. see above.

So now back to you orginal question what amps I reccomend??
For amplifing a pair of speakers or a sub you need a 2 channel amp. For powering speakers either front or rear or even a sub, this amp will give you everything you need. http://www.crutchfield.com/S-D87VrbEQ0D5/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=108R7521A

If you want to amplify the fronts as well as the rears or a sub then you need a 4 channel amp. I like this one: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-D87VrbEQ0D5/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=108R7541A

If I were you, I would upgrade the front 5x7s and buy the sub I mentioned with the 4 channel amp I mentioned as well. This is in my opinion the most cost effective way to improve the sound of any stock stereo.

Any other questions, feel free to ask. If you want higherend product reccomendations just ask.

PS -- Infinity amps are good but their speakers are horrific at least to me. Don't buy infinity speakers.
 

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The only reason why i tried adding the 6x9s in the rear was because i didnt want to waste trunk space. I ran them full with no crossover, and than just the lows. Again as I said many many many times i didnt like it. Like pkoko said, its not wise to run your 6x9s full in the back because it ruins your soundstage, but everyone has their own opinion (again many many many times i said it lol).

pkoko is right, think first about what you are trying to accomplish. One you got that figured out you can best decide which setup you will follow ;) I had my mind set that the 6x9s were going to kick as subs in the rear deck. Once I installed them and tested it out, well it did nothing for me. Luckily for you and I, return policies are great lol! Just dont do anything un-fixable (is that a word?) like cut holes into your back deck because if you find out you dont like it, you're sol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I do not want a sub. I dealt with subs in my F150 and loved to hate them. I haul way too many people to way too many golfing outings in my Fusion - I have no room for a sub.

I want to accomplish clearer sound, not necessarily bass. I want a more powerful radio. I am going to buy the 6x9's first, but I think that after they are installed, replacing the 5x7's in the door is the option.

I bought a pair of the Polk 953 6x9's for the rear today. I am going to buy two pair of the 95's (5x7) to replace the ones in the door. I have a feeling that's coming very very soon after I put in the 6x9's.

So, that's what I want. I don't want bass at all - I want good, rich full range sound.
 

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if you want a rich full sound i would of spent some money on a pair of compenents for the front and ran them off an amp. But some people like there sound to come from the back so maybe thats the best choice for you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well, I decided what I'm going to do. I'm installing two pair of Boston S85's (5x7 2-way) in the door, and a pair of Boston S953's (6x9 - 3 way) and amp 'em all.

Can someone recommend an amp on 2 pair of 5x7's with 35 RMS and 120 peak and an amp on a pair of 6x9's with 45RMS and 140 peak? All speakers have sensitivity 92 with 4 Ohm dual core impedance.

Do I really even need to amp these speakers?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
sternyy - I am looking for amplification for my two pair of 5x7/6x8's in the doors, and I have no idea what I'm looking for. I was told by someone that RMS rating doesn't matter a darn, but if it didn't matter then amps wouldn't mention their RMS ratings. The 5x7/6x8 2-ways that I'm putting in the door have a reputation for putting out lots of very good high quality sound. I'm balancing them with modest 6x9's.

Now my question is with amplification. I'm looking for amps, but I don't see many that have 35W RMS ratings, but see plenty that can handle 40 and 50W RMS.

The ones in the front - 35RMS - 120W peak
The 6x9's on the back deck - 45RMS, 140 peak.

Ideally (if possible), I'd love to run all these speakers off one amp, but a 6-channel amp just doesn't seem to exist.

Does it matter if I buy an amp that is 50W RMS and use it to power the 35W speakers? How exactly does all this work? I have tried to find somewhere online that speaks about which amps go with what speaker setup, but the world of amps is just too broad to allow anyone to do that.

Any help is greatly appreciated.
 

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Well 6 channel amps exist see JL e6450 at www.JLaudio.com

But you don't need it. Again on wattage. Wattage is only important for subs not speakers. Speaker manufacteurs list wattage b/c wattage sells. Go look at the best JL compoents (ZR line) they are rated on only 60W RMS yet these are $1000 speakers. People run them up to 200W RMS with no issue. That RMS # is the reccomended # to get good performance out of them. Another example, go look up "Focal Utopia components". Those speakers are rated at 75W RMS and are $2500 speakers. The reccomend "matching amplifier" puts 200 W RMS. again the # is the reccomended wattage for "acceptable" performance. Wattage is only important for subs (power really matters) and not speakers. If you listned to music (not bass music; like flute any music w/o bass) at 35W RMS; it will be painfully loud (120 db). If you want to discuss further let me know to provide links for you. It will be a lot of reading though. :D

You can power those speakers anywhere from 15 W RMS (deck power) to 100 W RMS (good amp) w/ no problem. Trust me wattage is not important; wattage sells speakers like towing capacity for trucks for majority owners who will never approach them. Why list it & compare it; b/c it sells. If I were you, I would buy the infinity 4 channel amp I reccomended. if it is too pricey let me know and I will find one cheaper.
 

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Pkoko what you said may be a bit misleading... a 2 channel 200 watt rms amp is only running 100 watts rms per channel. If you were to get a 2 channel 100 watt rms amp you are only pushing 50 watts RMS per channel. With the $2500 75rms speaker example, the 200w rms amp matches up, a 100 watts rms amp DOES NOT!

You ALWAYS want to get an amp that has a bit more power for your speakers so you dont under power them. You dont want to underpower your speakers if you want to use how they are intended to be used. Its like giving a 87 octane gas to a car the requires 92 and higher... wattage does matter with any type of speaker, and matching it up correctly is most important.

The cost of speakers and wattage has no corelation, you are right there... a $100 speaker can have the same wattage as a $2000 speaker, its the material and the magnet thats makes the difference in cost.
 

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sternyy,

I know this; the # I gave him are per channel to simplify it for him. Please go look them up.

One of my best Friends own a stereo shop. When we were in HS; car audio was our hobby. That was 5 years ago. I still know a lot car audio. in my spare time, I even help his potential customers with their car audio decisions. We have went to many car audio shows; and listned to most major brands and have a good idea what is good.

BTW the biggest difference in cost of high end components are the crossovers & magnets. A high quality crossover can cost up to $300 in parts per speaker. And nudonuim magnets are 3-5x cost of regular magnets. Those magnets have 2-3 more magnetic field around them so speaker sounds clearer and more efficient.

I am not trying to offend you, If I did then I am sorry.

Most people who buy those $1000+ speakers; know very very little about them. Most of them don't know; that good placement and tunning is far more important than acctual speakers. Those watage # are what gives of "acceptable performance". I once ran infinity 3.5 coaxilals (15W RMS rating) of a 50W RMS amp. I ran it for 3 years with no issues. Wattage is irrelevant for regular speakers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I like the idea of the 4-channel amp. Would it be more worth the amp's effectiveness to run it on the front door 5x7's and back deck 6x9's and leave the rear door 5x7's alone?
 

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yes that is my idea. leave the rear doors alone.
 
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