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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well, I went to get in the car this morning, and the pass side rear tire was nearly flat. I took the tire off the car and checked all the way around and there is no apparent damage or puncture. Since I couldn't find anything, I just aired it back up and went to town. After about 5 hours of sitting I decided to check the pressure again, and it's down almost 15psi already. Needless to say, I'm slightly concerned since this comes soon after taking the car well above 100mph a few times. I'll take it to a tire store tomorrow to have it checked out, and hopefully they can find a puncture or some other good reason why the tire is losing air, and not just tire failure. :(
 

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hmm... The stock Michelins are good 'till 112, correct? I've been there myself a few times -- yet my tires hold air like no tomorrow. Never had an issue [knock on wood]. Let us know, bud. Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The stockers are V speed rated which means they should be good to 149mph. Now I haven't been going quite that fast, but I have had them over 130 a couple times.

I'm starting to think it's time for some high performance summer tires.
 

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If there is no visable damage to the tire it is most likely leaking around the bead! All aluminum rims could potentially develop this problem. It normally happens after the tires have been replaced though. Normaly the tire shop will clean the area around the bead with a scotch brite pad and remount it. This normaly fixes the problem unless, you have rim damage. Or the source of you problem could be simpler. Do you park your car in a heated garage and, do you live in a cold climate? Air pressure in your tires is sensative to temperature! If you go to a good local tire shop you can get your tires filled with nitrogen. nitrogen does not expand and contract with the temperature!
 

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Check the tire valve where you put air in. Sometimes the inside portion becomes loose and you have to screw it back in. There is the small tool you can buy for under a dollar that does the trick. I carry one in my glove compartment.
 

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[quote author=furious1auto link=topic=66969.msg1149929#msg1149929 date=1168834887]
Nitrogen does not expand and contract with the temperature!
[/quote]No, it just explodes on impact! ;)
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1149872#msg1149872 date=1168832000]
Well, I went to get in the car this morning, and the pass side rear tire was nearly flat. I took the tire off the car and checked all the way around and there is no apparent damage or puncture.
[/quote]
Five will get you 10 there is a small puncture of some sort, one not easily visible. It could be a faulty valve stem too. Keep us posted on what the problem was and how it was corrected. Curious minds want to know. :) Boz
 

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[quote author=swoop1156 link=topic=66969.msg1150379#msg1150379 date=1168876073]
[quote author=furious1auto link=topic=66969.msg1149929#msg1149929 date=1168834887]
Nitrogen does not expand and contract with the temperature!
[/quote]No, it just explodes on impact! ;)
[/quote]

Hi swoop1156. I'm not sure if you are serious or just joking, so here goes: If you are joking, :lmao: good one!
If you are serioius, Nitrogen is an inert gas, it will not explode in an accident. In fact, if you were to strike a match in a room full of Nitrogen, the match would extinguish itself (and if you stayed in the room, you would soon be unconscious, then dead, from lack of oxygen).
Perhaps you are thinking of Hydrogen?
If you were only joking, I'm a little slow today :dunno:, so I will laugh at myself, and I apologize for correcting you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Turned out to be a tiny pinhole leak in the tread. There wasn't anything in the hole, so I don't know for sure what caused it. The tire is patched for now, but will be replaced soon.
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1151017#msg1151017 date=1168898829]
Turned out to be a tiny pinhole leak in the tread. There wasn't anything in the hole, so I don't know for sure what caused it. The tire is patched for now, but will be replaced soon.
[/quote]
Thanks for posting an update. There is no real reason to replace a tire that has one of today's modern plugs. It will be just fine in all probability. I've had numerous plugs over the years and every one of them worked just fine; no leaks; no problems. I would never replace a tire just because it had a plug in it, unless it also had a lot of miles on it, which doesn't seem to be your case. Boz
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1151017#msg1151017 date=1168898829]
Turned out to be a tiny pinhole leak in the tread. There wasn't anything in the hole, so I don't know for sure what caused it. The tire is patched for now, but will be replaced soon.
[/quote]

Hi hwm3. Glad you were able to find the problem. As urnews stated, there is no need to replace the tire. If you had the patch done at a reputable tire shop, the tire actually is just fine. According to most tire manufacturers, a properly patched tire even keeps it's speed rating and warranty. However, if you should have another puncture, some manufacturer's do not like a tire to be patched a second time, and will recommend replacement.
You do want to look out for shops which repair tires with "plugs". Many "plugs" (especially the quickie type, poked through from the outside of the tire) can be problematical, and in general, are not recommended (of course, always refer to your tire manufacturer's warranty info). But a proper patch, where the tire is taken off the wheel, cleaned and patched from the inside, is fine.
You can save yourself a $150 or so, and just keep the tire. Of course, it is up to you. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Actually, most manufacturers void the speed rating of the tire when it has been patched. I'd replace the tire even if they didn't, since it's just not worth the chance to save a few bucks.
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1151133#msg1151133 date=1168904050]
Actually, most manufacturers void the speed rating of the tire when it has been patched. I'd replace the tire even if they didn't, since it's just not worth the chance to save a few bucks.
[/quote]


Hi hwm3. I respect your decision to replace the tire if you are not comfortable with a patched tire, and don't mind spending the money. I would do the same if I were routinely approaching the V Speed rating (149 MPH) of our tires on a daily basis. But the closest I would get to that nowadays, would be about half (75MPH) :shock:

However, so others have the proper information, and can make an informed decision, I visited the Michelin, Goodyear and BF Goodrich sites to check their warranty coverages. All three state that if a tire is repaired correctly, according to "Rubber Manufacturer's Association" guidelines, the tires original warranty and speed rating remain intact. Of course, if someone has a different brand, check their particular warranty.
There are guidelines, such as the puncture being no larger than 1/4 of an inch in size, the number of cords which can be severed, the puncture location, etc. Actually according to the regulations, if any of these guidelines (puncture size, # of cords etc) are exceeded, the tire cannot be repaired and must be replaced. Of course, a manufacturer's tire store will most likely follow the regulations. We probably have to be more wary of the local service station not following R.M.A guidelines.

Also, as stated earlier, "plugs" which are installed from the outside of the tread, are not considered proper repairs, and do void warranty and speed ratings. But, if punctures are repaired according to R.M.A regulations, the tire does retain all warranties and speed ratings.
I hope this information is helpful for others on the forum. Good luck. :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
While some tire manufacturers may say that the speed rating is not affected by a proper repair, how would you ever prove that the repair was proper? Too many variables for me. Besides, my car see rally and autocross duty, so no patched tires for me. I'd suggest the same to anyone that occasional drives a little "spirited".

Here's some info according to TireRack.com:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=77
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1151384#msg1151384 date=1168912763]
While some tire manufacturers may say that the speed rating is not affected by a proper repair, how would you ever prove that the repair was proper? Too many variables for me. Besides, my car see rally and autocross duty, so no patched tires for me. I'd suggest the same to anyone that occasional drives a little "spirited".

Here's some info according to TireRack.com:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=77
[/quote]

Hi hwm3. As I said, I understand and respect your decision. You race your car, and must do what is best for you. If I was racing my car, I would probably do the same. But most of us don't race. Trust me, I am not trying to change your mind. Neither of us is wrong. In this case, it is up to the individual to decide what they feel comfortable doing.

I am only providing the information for others, since it will not be just you and me reading this.

If any of us have a tire repaired either at the manufacturer's stores (Goodyear, Michelin, BF Goodrich etc), or at the Ford or L/M Dealer, the warranty and speed rating remains intact. It is clearly stated in the warranty. That is why I would always recommend going to an Authorized Dealer for your brand of tire for any type of repair. Save your receipts. That is your proof. If they fix it, it is their responsibility.

By the way, best of luck in your Rally and AutoCross racing!
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
My point is, why risk it? If you think they would willingly take responsibility for an accident you have after having a tire repaired, your nuts. Even if the tire was the cause of an accident, you'd likely spend far more trying to prove it than you would ever receive in compensation.

I know this thread will be read by more than just you and I, that is why I am trying to provide my point. Is it worth the risk to drive on a repaired tire? In my opinion it is not. Warranty or not, having a tire fail at highway speed would likely not turn out well. I don't plan to take that chance, and would recommend that others do the same, regardless of what the tire manufacturers may claim.

Don't take offense, it's just my opinion. Even if they did willingly honor the warranty, that's not a claim I'd like to have to make.
 

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[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66969.msg1151444#msg1151444 date=1168914478]
My point is, why risk it? If you think they would willingly take responsibility for an accident you have after having a tire repaired, your nuts. Even if the tire was the cause of an accident, you'd likely spend far more trying to prove it than you would ever receive in compensation.

I know this thread will be read by more than just you and I, that is why I am trying to provide my point. Is it worth the risk to drive on a repaired tire? In my opinion it is not. Warranty or not, having a tire fail at highway speed would likely not turn out well. I don't plan to take that chance, and would recommend that others do the same, regardless of what the tire manufacturers may claim.

Don't take offense, it's just my opinion. Even if they did willingly honor the warranty, that's not a claim I'd like to have to make.


[/quote]

Sigh...I am not taking offense, you have not been hostile or insulted me. And I hope it stays that way :cheers:
I also am just stating my opinion and providing backing information and the warranty facts for other readers. Neither of us is wrong. We have both made educated decisions according to our own circumstances
Now that we have both stated our opinions, readers are free to make an educated decision, according to their own circumstances.
Again, good luck with your Racing endeavors!
 

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FYI those Micheys are $226 at the Ford Dealer and I priced them at tire stores, anywhere from $240-$299. You might be able to order online for around $175? Dem tires ain't cheap! I got stuck, 2 inch gash in tire with car on flatbed to Ford dealer...........................$226 plus $22 to mount and balance..................ouch!
 

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[quote author=tnoah link=topic=66969.msg1151841#msg1151841 date=1168930374]
FYI those Micheys are $226 at the Ford Dealer and I priced them at tire stores, anywhere from $240-$299. You might be able to order online for around $175? Dem tires ain't cheap! I got stuck, 2 inch gash in tire with car on flatbed to Ford dealer...........................$226 plus $22 to mount and balance..................ouch!
[/quote]

Hi tnoah. Just an FYI. I know it' s a little too late for your first flat tire, but it may be helpful in the future, for those who are not in emergency situations.

First, Ford has a Price Match Guarantee, if you have time to gather competitors written prices.

Next, The Tirerack.com has the Fusion SEL OEM tire (listed as the Michelin Pilot HX MXM4 - 225/50/VR17) priced at $163.
The Fusion SE and S OEM tire (listed as the Continental Conti ProContact - 205/60/TR15) is on special at $50.

Another bit of info for Fusion SEL or top model Milan (Premium?) owners, is The Tire Rack also has the OEM tire from the Lincoln MKZ (Michelin Energy MXV4 S8 - 225/50/VR17), priced at $136, a $100 savings for 4 tires. It actually is higher rated than the Pilot in all categories by The Tire Rack. My only word of caution is that I would think it may be a more comfort and ride oriented tire than the Pilot, since it is on the Lincoln. Therefore it may not appeal to driver's who would like a firmer ride with more grip. But it may be a good choice for those who want a smoother riding tire. I guess you can always ask the Tire Rack reps for advice.
Also, for those that have a COSTCO membership, they also have excellent prices on tires. Again, a word of caution: Their tire prices come with mounting, balancing, disposal etc, and a Road Hazard Warranty (free flat repairs, free rotations, etc.) built into the price. So while their upfront price is higher, you can possibly save money over the long run. Do the math for your own circumstances.

I am certain there are other good tire retailers with excellent prices (plus other tire brand and model choices), but at least we have a few to start with.

I hope this information may help save someone some money. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I won't be replacing mine with the stock Michelins. While they are a good OE tire, they don't have enough grip for competition. You can find much better performance tires for quite a bit less than the cost of the stock Michelins.
 
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