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Wow they are cheap. I've never been an handling kind of guy though. I like to go fast in a straight line LOL.

So what exactly would I benefit out of getting the springs and the sway bars?

What the hell do sway bars do? IDK..maybe I need to test drive a fusion with and without sway bars and new springs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
sway bars transfer mass from one side to the other. A car going around a corner leans.... when you attach sway bars you are using the sway bars to resist the lean. This makes the tires stay in full contact with the road improving handling. You could resist sway with BIGGER springs... but then the car would ride much harder. Sway bars are mostly neutral when not cornering. So... sway bars in effect give you a tighter, more assured handling when going through corners
 

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I've never heard of Suspension Techniques, the prices are high, and they don't look that good. What are the spring rates and swaybar sizes?

The Fusion doesn't need an increase in grip from the suspension as much as it needs improved balance front to rear. The stock setup is very soft in the rear, and that gives the car a heavy understeer bias.

For example, you can buy Eibach Fusion coils for $199 shipped, Racing Beat front swaybar for $145 shipped, and Racing Beat rear swaybar for $132 shipped. You could even buy a complete Racing Beat suspension package which includes coils AND both swaybars for $450. That's a MUCH better deal on MUCH better parts than the Suspension Techniques pieces.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=66001.msg1132055#msg1132055 date=1167877790]
I've never heard of Suspension Techniques, [/quote]

Hmmm so because you've never heard of them that makes them less valuable??? Pardon me but Suspension Techniques has been in the automotive handling industry for nearly 20 years! Your lack of knowledge doesn't make their parts less worthy... maybe you should look at other companies and LEARN something about the industry......

http://www.stracing.com/ here you go...... educate yourself!!

Oh... before you go off.... I'm 47, I've been in the automotive industry for over 30 years... I've been a certified tech as well as a ceritifed parts specialist. I've been working in the aftermarket industry, helping clients decide what is best for their driving style, for nearly 6 years....
 

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[quote author=oldeskewltoy link=topic=66001.msg1132797#msg1132797 date=1167930432]educate yourself!![/quote]

You should take your own advice. If you really think a 19mm rear swaybar is worth the effort, you obviously don't know much about the Fusion. That is only a 3mm increase in size, and the same as a stock Mazda6 swaybar. Why in the world would someone pay nearly $200 for that?

It's also apparent that the Suspension Techniques parts WON'T reduce the Fusion's understeer tendency, in fact it will likely make it worse since it increases the size of the front swaybar MORE than the rear bar.

Do you even own a Fusion, or are you just here to try and sell us on some overpriced, underengineered suspension parts?
 

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Ridiculing or questioning someone because of their statements is never a good way to get a point across. There are always trade-offs in adding aftermarket performance parts. This is exactly why you can't just buy the maximum performance for each part and think the end result will guarantee a balanced vehicle. Decisions have to be made as to what type of driving you do and the performance you seek to accomplish that. That means you cannot just discount something based on a couple of numbers without some real world testing involved.
 

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My opinions are based on real world experience and testing. I've installed Eibach coils and a 27mm Racing Beat rear swaybar. Even with the HUGE Racing Beat rear bar, the car still understeers quite a bit. It's better than stock, but still not ideal. Knowing this I can say with a great deal of certainty that a 19mm rear swaybar would be much less effective at balancing the car. Adding the Suspension Techniques front bar would just make things worse. Yes, it would reduce body roll, but it would hurt the overall balance of the car.

For example, in autocross, which is heavy reliant upon chassis balance and handling, it is fairly common to disconnect the front swaybar of a FWD car altogether in order to reduce the understeer that is typical of FWD cars. Adding a larger rear swaybar has a similar effect, whereas adding a larger front swaybar would have the opposite effect. This is why I'm still running the stock front swaybar, along with the Racing Beat rear swaybar.

Don't take my posts the wrong way. If I have offended you, I apologize as that was not my intention. My intent is simply to relay my personal experience with modifying the suspension of these cars, and based on the numbers provided there are much better choices in coils and swaybars than the Suspension Techniques parts, especially considering their cost.
 

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You didn't offend me at all. I just wanted to point out that making personal attacks(i.e. you obviously don't know much about the Fusion) is not a good way to make your point. I don't know that you intended on coming across that way or not. It is possible to post contradicting information without resorting to comments that make the other person look bad.
 

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It wasn't personal at all, and I probably should have found a more tactful way of getting my point across. I just get a little irritated when things like this come up. This company, Suspension Techniques, is trying to sell what is basically a stock Mazda6 rear swaybar for nearly $200.

I'm curious as to the original posters intention. Is he a fellow Fusion/Milan/MKZ owner that is using the Suspension Techniques parts, and wanted to give us his first hand experience with them? Or is he just here trying to sell us the Suspension Techniques parts?
 

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That's a good question. I see now that his post count is only 3. So what effect would just replacing the rear sway bar with a Mazda 6 have? How much is the Mazda 6 swaybar? Also, would any of this stuff work on the Zephyr?
 

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The fact that his first post came across as being here only to try and sell something was part of the reason I was so abrupt. Maybe he'll reply and explain his intentions. If he is here trying to sell a product, he should become a site sponsor like the other contribution vendors have.

The Mazda6 bar is only a 19mm bar, so the effect would be minimal and you probably wouldn't even notice the difference. The stock rear bar on our cars is 16mm, so the change pretty minor. If you wanted to give one a try, I'm sure you could pick one by posting in a Mazda6 forum. Any of those guys that have swapped out their swaybar would like let you have thier stock one for little, if any cash. Since the suspensions are shared between these cars, the parts will also work on your Zephyr. Hope that helps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Ok... yes my count is low... new here... doesn't mean I'm new to automobiles. Why am I new? simple nephew purchased a Milan and asked me to look into parts.

Why can a 19mm bar out handle a 20mm... when they are made from DIFFERNT materials! The OEM bars are likely ductile and rather sloppy... they also use rubber mounts and pivots. Suspension Techniques uses urethane - even stiffer bushings will make OEM parts work better. Now I DON'T work for Suspension Techniques.. I work for clients and I found that this kit was a brand new introduction... I did know of other kits... this was a NEW intro....


Have you used the Suspension Techniques kit for the Fusion? then how can you say you use real world driving... you've NEVER driven this kit! So you DON'T know... do you????

Bars are only PART of the equasion to get the Fusion to "rotate"... turn with less understeer. The rear springs go a LOOONG way at getting the rear to roate... and the two are made in conjunction with each other.

I've been assisting clients with front wheel drive woes for years... The Fusion doesn't bring a new problem... what is NEW is the ST kit!

By the way... 16mm to 19mm is a SUBSTANTIAL change! Well over 15%! when using the same material!

Btw... I'll bet you $1.00 that I can make your car rotate with out you spending ANYMORE $$??? Simple really... put the OEM FRONT sway bar back on! I'll guarantee your car has less understeer.

IDEALLY... each car should have its OWN kit... why? simple really... no two are the same mass... so one spring kit MAY work better on the Fusion, while another may be better on a Milan, or Mazda 6. Finally this is all moot really for NONE of these kits are LINEAR springs - linear spring has a single rating, progrssive springs change their rates - Eibach ProKit are progressive springs! Btw... so are the ST springs....


<BREATH.........>
Ok... I'm sorry... sorry for just barging in with out more details about me... I've been doing this a LOOOONG time... and every company I work for(I answer emails from their clients - this is what I DO for a living!) is required to one major policy.... The emailer is my "customer", I answer THEIR questions to THEIR satisifaction... if the company I'm answering emails for doesn't have a part... I don't tell the client it isn't available... I tell him it IS available, and in many cases I'll give them the link to the competing retailer! Here is a trifold marketing brochuere I've had printed up... (my mailing address is out of date... but you'll get the idea.....

http://www.cyberauto.com/IACG_Brochure.pdf
 

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We could go back and forth for hours on this and get nowhere. I'm just trying to give you a little info, which you can either use or not. If you have more info that would lead us to believe the Suspension Techniques setup IS ideal, please give it to us. Thing like spring rate and such would be extremely helpful.

Now, there are a few different rear swaybars available for the Fusion, and the Suspension Techniques is the smallest, at 19mm, only matching the stock Mazda6 bar. The Racing Beat bar being the largest at 27mm. So unless the Suspension Techniques rear coils are significantly firmer in the rear than any other coils available for the Fusion, it would be a reasonable assumption that the ST suspension setup would have a HIGHER understeer tendency than an Eibach setup with a RB rear swaybar. If you know the ST rear coils to be significantly firmer, please let us know. Without that info, the ST setup is simply not gonna compare well to the other parts that are available.

My suggestion for a suspension setup after having "real world experience" with my current setup would be a complete Racing Beat suspension package for the Mazda6, which includes both front and rear swaybars, as well as coils that will be firmer in the rear to aid in balancing the suspension. On top of this, the Racing Beat package can be had for only $50 more than the ST swaybar only package.

Remember, your the one that came here and started a thread titled "Handling SOLUTION". All I'm asking for you to do is explain why we should use your "Handling SOLUTION" over the other, more cost effective options.
 

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[quote author=oldeskewltoy link=topic=66001.msg1133277#msg1133277 date=1167946543]
Btw... I'll bet you $1.00 that I can make your car rotate with out you spending ANYMORE $$??? Simple really... put the OEM FRONT sway bar back on! I'll guarantee your car has less understeer.[/quote]

Are you reading any of my replies? I'm still running the stock front swaybar.

[quote author=oldeskewltoy link=topic=66001.msg1133277#msg1133277 date=1167946543]
IDEALLY... each car should have its OWN kit... why? simple really... no two are the same mass... so one spring kit MAY work better on the Fusion, while another may be better on a Milan, or Mazda 6. Finally this is all moot really for NONE of these kits are LINEAR springs - linear spring has a single rating, progrssive springs change their rates - Eibach ProKit are progressive springs! Btw... so are the ST springs....[/quote]

The Racing Beat springs are LINEAR.

[quote author=oldeskewltoy link=topic=66001.msg1133277#msg1133277 date=1167946543]
<BREATH.........>
Ok... I'm sorry... sorry for just barging in with out more details about me... I've been doing this a LOOOONG time... and every company I work for(I answer emails from their clients - this is what I DO for a living!) is required to one major policy.... The emailer is my "customer", I answer THEIR questions to THEIR satisifaction... if the company I'm answering emails for doesn't have a part... I don't tell the client it isn't available... I tell him it IS available, and in many cases I'll give them the link to the competing retailer! Here is a trifold marketing brochuere I've had printed up... (my mailing address is out of date... but you'll get the idea.....

http://www.cyberauto.com/IACG_Brochure.pdf
[/quote]

Like I posted above, if you have info on why we should choose the ST setup, please let us know. So far, you haven't given us any.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
just been to RB link... they say 20% stiffer... but NOTHING about linear or progressive....

Ok... ok... I had though I had read you used both RB bars... apologies...

something is waaay wrong if you have a 27mm rear bar and a spring kit and you CAN'T get the car to rotate.... as a test you may want to try to disconnect the front bar (at the end links) and see what happens...

Concerning details on the ST kit... I have none... the kit is THAT new!
 

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The problem, as I have stated earlier in this thread, is that the Fusion has very soft rear springs. Since all the aftermarket coils increase the rates by the same % front and rear, the problem still exists with aftermarket coils. This is why I suggest a set of aftermarket coils for the Mazda6. It doesn't have the same problem with the way too soft rear coils. The Mazda6 guys that run the Eibach coils and the RB rear sway actually get oversteer in certain situations, so it fairly obivous that the soft rear coils are the problem.

Like I said earlier, if you find out any info on the ST parts, please feel free to pass it on. Until then, I'll continue to recommend the RB setup.
 

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Just FYI.

The material in which the swaybars are made of and the types of bushings you use do make all the difference in the world. You can have a swaybar the same dimensions as a stock and make it out of lets say chrome-moly and use urethane bushings instead of sloppy rubber bushings. The car with the upgraded parts would greatly out-perform the stock car.

Other points like springs rates and mm size also count. But thats just the surface.

:goodjob:
 

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Too bad the ST swaybars in this discussion are made of the same solid steel that the stock bars are. The RB bar is a HUGE improvement over stock, and still cheaper than the ST bar.
 
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