[pete]

The planets finally aligned...

We are working with Shift Marketing on their SEMA vehicles, (2) 2006 Zephyrs. Troy and I met at the dyno to thrash on their black Zephyr. I don't recall how many miles it has on it but I am sure it can't be much which means the HP and torque will only increase as the engine breaks in more.

The highlights:
- Their Zephyr is basically stock. The baseline and modified runs were both made with the inlet elbow in front of the airbox removed.   
- The testing was done on a Dynojet 224.
- All numbers are SAE, temp was 83, humidity 51%
- All testing was done with premium fuel which means the baseline numbers are higher than what you would see with 87 octane.

Peak numbers were:
Stock                                                              FordChip
164.6 whp @ 5700                                           185.8 whp @ 6200  +21.2
162.2 ft/lbs. @ 5100                                         166.6 ft/lbs @ 5300  +4.4

Average numbers are approx.:
Stock                                                               FordChip
143.7 whp                                                       177.0 whp  +33.3
150.3 ft/lbs.                                                     159.2 ft/lbs. +8.9        


I am fairly pleased with the gains in HP but not sure what to make of the gains in torque. I'd like to get another on the dyno in the near future and work with some more changes for torque.

I'll have to defer to Troy for feedback on driving it now. I know from the previous vehicles we have done, plus the continued changes we develop that its a very nice kick. Between the power and the trans changes it ought to gain about .5s 0-60. 


We have a long history of personally tuning 2.5L and 3.0L Duratecs in everything from Contours and Taurii to Escapes, 500s and Fusions... We will continue to work on the ETC 3.0Ls.

And yes as always we will continue to work on the I-4 stuff as well.

 

[Metallicat]

Why do you think the stock numbers are so low, or is that typical for the 3.0? That would be about a 25% loss through the drivetrain. My F150 pulled like 20 more hp at the rear wheels stock and it was only rated at 15 hp more at the crank (235 hp 5.4 version) for about a 20% loss through its big 4 speed drivetrain. Maybe the 235 hp rating was conservative on my truck. What kind of stock numbers did you see on the non-variable cammed Taurus / 500 Duratec 3.0? Seems like Ford left a lot of performance on the table with these engines. Can you post the dyno graphs of both runs? Also, how is the average hp increase so high when average torque has not been increased substantially? I know that hp is just a numerical calculation derived from measured torque and all...and I can understand the peak values, if you extend the torque curve in the upper rpm ranges you'll naturally develope mpre hp. But the average values of tq / hp under the curve have me puzzled (not that I am a dyno expert or anything). That is why it would be helpful to see the graphs! Thanks!

 

[pete]

I edited the numbers. After looking more at the data I had included data points that either were at the speed limiter or weren't truly at WOT.

25% for a front drive 6spd auto is acceptable.

I don't have curves I have numerical tables. I'll try to post them. I made no changes to the stcok file before the baseline = we were limited to about 5900prms. With the modified file we took it to 6400. Even at the same 5700rpm peak for the stock file, my modified file made 14 whp more.

The more aggressive timing table and some tweaks specific to ETC really wake the car up. There is more in it. I hope to get another one on the dyno soon.

 

[pete]

Coming soon... Dyno numbers from Metallicat's I-4, 5spd.

 

[pete]

Metallicat may not be ready for a while... Any I-4s in Metro Detroit interested?

We will also have the Shift Marketing Zephyr back on the dyno after they install their Magnaflow exhaust.

 

[WiKDMoNKY]

They are V6's or an I4's?

 

[pete]

[quote author=WiKDMoNKY link=topic=53385.msg892016#msg892016 date=1155771820]
They are V6's or an I4's?
[/quote]

All Zephyrs are V6s.

 

[WiKDMoNKY]

Then why is the horsepower 57hp lower than what mine is rated?

And why, whith your chip, is it still 36hp lower than what mine is rated?


Sounds wrong...

 

[hwm3]

[quote author=WiKDMoNKY link=topic=53385.msg893511#msg893511 date=1155827867]
Then why is the horsepower 57hp lower than what mine is rated?

And why, whith your chip, is it still 36hp lower than what mine is rated?


Sounds wrong...
[/quote]

These numbers are at the wheels vs. the factory ratings at the crankshaft.

 

[Metallicat]

Yeah, hp at the wheels is always 15-20% lower than the actual hp rating from the factory! At the factory, they just strap the engine right to the dyno without measuring the losses through the drivetrain.

 

[FusionPowered06]

While that is true, the hp numbers that we are seeing here is closer to 30% loss than 15-20%. The numbers that pete came up with is average 140hp at the wheels. Doesn't the Zephyr have 220hp at the crank? That is an 80hp loss? WHAT?!? Is that six speed really sucking that much power? He did say that the engine would put out more power with more break in time, but he also said he was unsure of mileage.

I find these numbers very hard to believe. My 4x4 F-150 has less loss to the wheels than these cars do. Whats going on here?

 

[Metallicat]

THAT is exactly what I posted earlier! A 25-30% loss, to me, seems a bit extreme. My F150 also had less loss at the rear wheels than the Zephyr. Maybe the F150 was under-rated in hp (remember, the Fusion V6 was going to be rated around 210hp before the new standard was implemented - then it was rated at 221). Either way, the hp loss does seem pretty large. I expected more out of the FWD 6 speed auto.

[quote author=FusionPowered06 link=topic=53385.msg895583#msg895583 date=1155857604]
While that is true, the hp numbers that we are seeing here is closer to 30% loss than 15-20%.  The numbers that pete came up with is average 140hp at the wheels.  Doesn't the Zephyr have 220hp at the crank?    That is an 80hp loss?  WHAT?!?  Is that six speed really sucking that much power?  He did say that the engine would put out more power with more break in time, but he also said he was unsure of mileage.

I find these numbers very hard to believe.  My 4x4 F-150 has less loss to the wheels than these cars do.  Whats going on here?
[/quote]

 

[hwm3]

[quote author=FusionPowered06 link=topic=53385.msg895583#msg895583 date=1155857604]
While that is true, the hp numbers that we are seeing here is closer to 30% loss than 15-20%.  The numbers that pete came up with is average 140hp at the wheels.  Doesn't the Zephyr have 220hp at the crank?    That is an 80hp loss?  WHAT?!?  Is that six speed really sucking that much power?  He did say that the engine would put out more power with more break in time, but he also said he was unsure of mileage.

I find these numbers very hard to believe.  My 4x4 F-150 has less loss to the wheels than these cars do.  Whats going on here?
[/quote]

The 140hp was average hp, not peak hp. The engine is rated at 221 peak hp @ 6250 RPM at the crank, and put 164hp to the wheels at 5700 RPM. Since your most accurate dyno numbers will be achieved in 5th gear, and you probably can't get to 6250 RPM in 5th gear on the stock tune due to the speed limiter, your gonna see a lower peak hp at a lower RPM on the stock tune. Notice the tuned peak HP is at 6200RPM? That's probably due to removal of the top speed limiter.

This is why I haven't purchased any tuning for the Fusion yet. At this point, I don't see the gains. If we were to be able to seen the charts for both the stock tune, and the modified tune, we could tell if there was really any more power being made on the modified tune. Comparing a peak HP reading on the stock tune at 5700 RPM, to a modified tune peak HP reading at 6200 RPM doesn't tell you anything really. The engine was allowed to rev nearly to it's peak HP RPM on the mod tune, but 500 RPM less on the stock tune. For all we know, the stock tune puts 185 HP to the wheels at 6200RPM.

 

[Total ConFUSION]

[quote author=pete link=topic=53385.msg889968#msg889968 date=1155734301]
.. Any I-4s in Metro Detroit interested?
[/quote]
Interested in what? Putting it on a dyno? Having a performance tune? If you wanna put my I4 Auto on a dyno and GIVE me free tuning I'd be up for it. I already have an Xcal2 I used on my old F150. 8)

 

[pete]

I made no changes to the stock vehicle. I could have locked it in 5th gear to get to 6200 but I wanted a 100% stock vehicle. As I pointed out the gains at 5700 was 14whp.

I don't know about the losses... You have to remember this is an ETC vehicle. They truncate power for shifts. Its possible the peak power at 5700 may have been truncated for the anticipated shift but the averages help to clear the picture.

The next time we have the car on the dyno we will run both the stock and modified file with the car locked in 5th until 6500. It should make the comparison clearer.

I'll also have an I-4 on the dyno later this week.

 

[pete]

[quote author=Total ConFUSION link=topic=53385.msg897210#msg897210 date=1155923649]
[quote author=pete link=topic=53385.msg889968#msg889968 date=1155734301]
.. Any I-4s in Metro Detroit interested?
[/quote]
Interested in what?  Putting it on a dyno?  Having a performance tune?  If you wanna put my I4 Auto on a dyno and GIVE me free tuning I'd be up for it.  I already have an Xcal2 I used on my old F150.   8)
[/quote]

I think we are all set but we'll keep it in mind.

 

[hwm3]

Post the charts so we can see the data over the entire rev range.

 

[pete]

We'll have our I-4 results after tonights dyno session.

 

[hwm3]

Post the graphs or the charts. Without them the numbers don't mean much.

Just looking at your numbers for the V6, at just over 5000RPM your tune gains less than 10hp over stock. That's not enough gain to offset the increased cost of premium fuel for me.

 

[pete]

[quote author=hwm3 link=topic=53385.msg910437#msg910437 date=1156431479]
Post the graphs or the charts. Without them the numbers don't mean much.

Just looking at your numbers for the V6, at just over 5000RPM your tune gains less than 10hp over stock. That's not enough gain to offset the increased cost of premium fuel for me.
[/quote]

Huh??? How did you get less than 10hp? The comparison at 5700 was 14hp.

Peak power nos. are almost irrelevant and just one part of the package. The average increases are what improves acceleration. The baseline with the Zephyr were run with premium as well which means they were higher than what you would see with 87.

The improved shift schedule, improved response and the power all add up to an improved feel for the vehicle.

For the skeptics...there is always a 30-day money-back guarantee if you don't think its worth it.