[Steelcity2424]

the crown vic is currently a car that ford really doesn't car about anymore except selling it to police.Back when the chevy caprice was in production it was better in any way to the crown vic and the police liked it better in handling and performance. A cop i know said he would never trust the crown vic like he did his caprice over 100. Ford really needs to upgrade it.

 

[Boggus]

Now more than ever since you can get a Charger with the Police Package which many PD's are switching to. Totally out handles and dominates the track over the Crown Vic.

 

[Drake]

They've let the poor Vic die slow death like the Taurus.

 

[Metallicat]

[quote author=Drake link=topic=50649.msg808504#msg808504 date=1152299011]
They've let the poor Vic die slow death like the Taurus. 
[/quote]

And the Ranger...Lincoln LS...Town Car...

 

[chris06fusion]

[quote author=Metallicat link=topic=50649.msg808704#msg808704 date=1152302709]
[quote author=Drake link=topic=50649.msg808504#msg808504 date=1152299011]
They've let the poor Vic die slow death like the Taurus.
[/quote]

And the Ranger...Lincoln LS...Town Car...
[/quote]

I 2nd that!

 

[Partscheap]

The whole delima behind the Crown Vic revamp is that the Ford Five Hundred was originally designed to be a replacement for the Crown Victoria so Ford division would have a luxurious car besides those in the Lincoln division. However they made the mistake of putting a V6 and making it front wheel drive, and in such a large car left the Five Hundred underpowered and not suitable for police work.

The Crown Victoria is a very large car, with plenty of space for computer equipment, radio's, weapons, radar gear and other items. It has the 4.6 V8 which is a strong reliable engine, and probably has the largest trunk out of any modern car, and believe me the police love to pack equipment back there. If Ford would have made the Five Hundred rear wheel drive, offered a base model without all the civilian goodies and stuck a 4.6 in there they would have had something, a redesigned Crown Victoria would be a great advancement for Ford as they are getting competition from dodge which is now offering a police cruiser version of their charger. Though i have not heard anything about them doing anything about it.

Last i checked i believe the lincoln LS will be discontinued in either 07 or 08. As for the Ranger, I think Ford is just lazy, that truck really needs a redesign.

 

[Drake]

LS is gone after '06. Another example of poor marketing on a great car.

 

[swoop1156]

Ford throws them in your face, and then you never see them in advertisements. It's like, "Hey! Here is our new car. We're only showing you 6 commercils, so remember it after you don't see it anymore." They need to CONTINUE the marketing!

 

[dr441600]

The Automobile business is just like every other business - management is everything. All of what is left of the Big 3 are hurting financially, mostly from bad management decisions in the past that are catching up with a totally different marketplace from 10 or even 20 years ago - more competition in the form of price as well as quality.

GM has invested in a relatively new line up of vehicles, while Ford and Chrysler have not. I've noticed that whenever there is a Ford family member at the helm, they squeeze every penny of profit out of the product line and invest very little (Hank the Deuce then, Bill Ford now). Granted, we are talking billions here, not pocket change, and it takes years to change momentum in this industry.

Just an observation, and I could be wrong, but it seems to go in 25-year cycles. In the 1930's through 1954, Ford was dominant with a cheap but hot flathead V8 and a strong product line. In 1955, when GM introduced the Chevy small block, Ford was promoting safety (nobody cared, a big blunder), and GM took over for about 25 years of sales and marketing dominance. In the 1980s, with the Japanese imports touting quality and economy, Ford and Chrysler improved quality while GM did nothing, and FoMoCo was again dominant. For a few years, Ford was even more profitable than GM. I certainly noticed the difference in product quality in the 1980s and 1990s, having owned cars of both manufacturers. Ford definitely made a better product. Now, it's the 21st Century, the bar has been raised yet again, and it looks as if Bill Ford and the Board of Directors are more interested in short term profit gains instead of the long-term life of the company. Hence, the blunder of the 500/Montego cost them almost everything, along with minimal enhancements to the product line, and product name changes (smoke and mirrors).

The Crown Vic platform COULD BE world class, but I don't expect it to happen. It could have been better than the old Impala SS, but Ford management was not interested in making it better - as long as they were making profit, who cared about improvement? They also killed the Marauder, closest thing to the Impala Police car.

My $.02 worth.

As a car enthusiast who understands how a publicly traded business runs, and who sees good and bad in all brands, I really hope that I am wrong about Ford. God I hope that I am wrong.

 

[urnews]

I sincerely hope that you are wrong, too, DR, but I fear that you will be correct. I read somewhere that the Crown Victoria is going to be dropped entirely. Of course we all know that Ford let the Taurus rot on the vine while FoMoCo cashed in on the SUV and F150 bonanza. That heyday has passed and Ford is playing catch-up with the Fusion and Edge and the silly renaming of the Five Hundred. The company does not seem to have a very bright future. It's a sad time.

 

[NaplesBill]

There is a bit of uninformed information here. First of all, GM had the oldest and most outdated chassis, underpinning most of their American cars, until they started borrowing from Holden and Opel over the last couple of years. So, they have really invested in new designs but they did bring over "better" designs they already had in Europe.

Second of all, Ford started development of the Fusion before the gas prices jumped and before SUV sales declined. They were aware of a shift coming they just didn't realize it would happen so quickly. The other thing you need to note is that Ford 1st qtr SUV sales were down something around 60-70% but overal sales only declined 16%. This speaks volumes to the success of the Fusion and Edge platforms and also shows that the 500 platform can be successful if it's marketed properly. The rename to the Taurus will actually be a good thing. Ask 10 people who makes the 500 or who makes the Taurus and see what happens. The name Taurus is synonymous with Ford. Time will tell all anyway but Ford is actually doing better than expected this year and I only see that improving.

 

[dr441600]

[quote author=NaplesBill link=topic=50649.msg1407981#msg1407981 date=1179143020]
There is a bit of uninformed information here. First of all, GM had the oldest and most outdated chassis, underpinning most of their American cars, until they started borrowing from Holden and Opel over the last couple of years. So, they have really invested in new designs but they did bring over "better" designs they already had in Europe.

Second of all, Ford started development of the Fusion before the gas prices jumped and before SUV sales declined. They were aware of a shift coming they just didn't realize it would happen so quickly. The other thing you need to note is that Ford 1st qtr SUV sales were down something around 60-70% but overal sales only declined 16%. This speaks volumes to the success of the Fusion and Edge platforms and also shows that the 500 platform can be successful if it's marketed properly. The rename to the Taurus will actually be a good thing. Ask 10 people who makes the 500 or who makes the Taurus and see what happens. The name Taurus is synonymous with Ford. Time will tell all anyway but Ford is actually doing better than expected this year and I only see that improving.
[/quote]

Bill, let's agree to disagree on this point. I still think GM's biggest problem was the same as Ford's for many years - management, which sets the pace of the company, the working environment, the culture, the creativity, the morale, product quality and ultimately the success. Roger Smith seemed as bad as Hank the Deuce, a rich goofball drowning in his own power. GM was always a better marketing company, and always thought a few steps ahead of Ford. Ford was almost always happy to have a "me too" product that wasn't quite as fast, roomy, appealing, etc. After Hank the Deuce died, Red Polling and several others (I can't recall their names) put some heart into the product line and brought back some performance. In the 1980s, the 302 Mustang was almost always faster than the 305 Camaro. That's one of the reasons why Chevy put in the corvette motor, they couldn't beat the 302. Nowadays, the small block chevy is in its umpteenth iteration, and Ford is typically doing nothing.

And so it goes on.

I still cherish my old '67 Galaxie.

 

[otaku]

Yeah the crown vic/marquis/town car could use some upgrading. To some extent it seems like they've replaced it with cars like the 500/taurus. Anyway a new vic could have: 6spd trans, awd and just better handling all the way round. New more modern style in and out with more technology etc. and a new less primitive V8 perhaps a 4.6l V8 32 valve (same size but better tech and more power etc)

 

[Lonnie]

I've read a few reports on the Charger in the past. Seems there's a problem that may help the CV sales still. When testing the Charger police packages they included the V8 with them. Now after testing the standard police package only comes with the V6 and at the same price Dodge put out. A little bait and switch here I would say. The government isn't willing pay the extra for the V8 option. So they are once again back to the CV because of the V8 and it's priced the same or close to the Charger V6. I've also talked with a couple of my local cop buddies and they told me the same thing.

 

[albeys06]

Utah HP is also going back to the crown vic. To many problems with trans and service. Hear say the fairlane from Austraila (charger eater) will be it's replacement in 2012.

 

[biggee72]

Crown vic parts are and always will be cheaper and more readily available. The dealer tells me that the CV is gone and the Grand Marquis is going to stay untouched. Police departments will still be able to purchase the crown vic but not civilians. Sort of remind me of the Ford Escort which was only available as a fleet vehicle in the later years. Ford like to make a car or truck successful and then ignore it. The charger will never out sell the Crown Vic. Chrysler police cars reputations went out in the mid-late 80's and IMHO they're gone forever. I'm still mad @ GM for getting rid of the caprice before I got my license as I'd be driving a 5.7L Caprice right now if they were available.

 

[Tardis98]

I had a 97 Vic and I loved that car. The panther platform does need to be thoroughly revamped though. I'd start with the Explorer's 6spd auto, bore out the 4.6 to 5.0 and for pete's sake, the last time that dash got an update was 1995!!
On a similar front, I would love to know how many Crown Vic's have died horrible deaths in the movies as police cars. Its got to be a few thousand,

 

[seneeb]

Not only does the Panther platform need to be revamped, it also needs to be expanded. There needs to be a Wagon version again. You can leave the 2 door model out. Have an option for a 5.4 or a 6.8 Hot Rod version like old muscle cars, big power, low options targeting younger crowd.

Also, AWD would be nice. but not 100% necessary. Better interior ergonomic design coupled with Sync (the radios are WAAAAAAAAY far away from the driving position).

Independant rear suspension
6spd close ratio paddle controlled automatic.
put a decent flipping stereo in it for crying out loud.

give me a convertable option, I love my mom's mustang convert, but i need significanly more room than a pony can give me. old caddies had fullsize convetables. hell, Ford had fullsize convertables!

heated and cooled seats are a must as well as the need for much better front seat lateral support. I dont want my cornering limited by my inability to stay planted in the seat in the proper driving position, i want the car's handling abilities to be my limit.

speaking of seats, give me a damned seat where there's less than a fist between the inside of my knee and the front edge of the seat.

But the overall underlying issue is not so much the cars. They're still great cars even though the underpinnnigs of a 2008 are damn near identical in design to the 1979 model (yes, i know, engine/trans differ, but that's basically fleetwide changes). The biggest problem is the consumer attitude that they are cars for "old people". Bullshit. I'm 27 years old and I've owned 2. I still own my 84. Got rid of my 97 because I was spending too much money and time on it as a toy and I dont like automatic transmissions for daily driver usage. Yes, my 84 is no longer stock and is actually a dedicated Track car.

Blek, guess i'll just have to win the lottery and restore old ones

 

[fatabbot]

[quote author=seneeb link=topic=50649.msg2460062#msg2460062 date=1215972657]
I still own my 84. Got rid of my 97 because I was spending too much money and time on it as a toy and I dont like automatic transmissions for daily driver usage. Yes, my 84 is no longer stock and is actually a dedicated Track car.

Blek, guess i'll just have to win the lottery and restore old ones
[/quote]

Got any pics of the '84? I have a fondness for the old Vics and Grand Marquis as my grandfather and my uncles all owned them back in the day.

 

[seneeb]

yes, yes i do! infact, it won Panther of the Month for July over at www.grandmarq.net

http://www.mpna.com/matt/ltd/images