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Discussion Starter #1
Are the rear deck speakers (the 6x9s) in the audiophile system crossed over? Or are they getting a full range output from the factory hu? If they do have a low pass somewhere upstream, where is it? In the hu? In the external amplifier? On the drivers? Or somewhere in between? Lastly, does anyone know the crossover point and slope?
 

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They have a low pass filter on them. I believe it's built into the factory amp. As far as the crossover point/slope without a scope who knows? If I was to take an educated guess it was prbly 100hz @ 12db.
 

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It's pretty close to that. I've seen 110Hz @ 12 dB. And yes, the crossover is built into the amp.
 

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Where can this information be found? does anyone have any more info on it?

Would it be for the same with the THX stereo? There are two 6x9 subs in the back meant strictly for bass, would they have the same 100-110hz crossover point you think or would they be able to play lower freq?

Reason I ask: Getting ready for my trunk build and doing a factory integration setup. But if the amp's are only sending 100+ hz to the speaker then really there is no point of tapping these wires for signal because the subs are meant to play everything below that point.

Anyone know if the signal from the HU is 20-20000 and only changed after the amps? If so i can use these wires for my setup instead of after the amp.
 

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When we are mentioning numbers it's that number and below. So <110hz .

The stock HU is not a pure source. I highly doubt you're going to get any real output below 40hz. It's just not reproduced by the HU (prbly to protect the speakers).

I dont know much about the Audiophile HU.. but the Sony HU couldn't be tapped like that due to multiple signal sources being transmitted to the amp. You would lose some kind of functionality.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
But its probably not a pure source whether you are tapping those signal lines or using an LOC off the front/rear speaker outs. So if you're keeping the stock HU you have to either live with it or use a Cleansweep-like device to compensate. It sounds like using that signal line for a sub is plausible at least. The only issues I see are that I think its a mono signal, and I'm not sure how its treated by the fader. The rear deck speakers are probably treated as rear speakers by the fader, but they might be unaffected since their purpose is to be "subwoofers" and not just rear fill.
 

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They are treated with the fader. I keep it balanced f/r, l/r ... 0+ or - any direction i mean.

When put to the full front, subs shut off gradually as you bring the stage forward, but when you bring it back to half, they dont get louder as you go to the rear, they just stay the same.

I'll probably just have to use the rear-sub signal and disconnect them completely to try and curb the DSP protection provided by the amps.

Thanks for the info gents, didnt mean to thread jack but i figured it could only benefit the questions already being asked :)
 

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Tag the signal at the input to the amp. If the factory amp has a subsonic on it, you'll be cutting frequencies. VBoM says the HU responds down to 22Hz. But, the factory amp probably cuts off mid-30s.
 

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[quote author=Ferendon link=topic=169273.msg3596837#msg3596837 date=1270186004]
Tag the signal at the input to the amp. If the factory amp has a subsonic on it, you'll be cutting frequencies. VBoM says the HU responds down to 22Hz. But, the factory amp probably cuts off mid-30s.
[/quote]

Input *TO* the amp? like the wires from the HU? I have no idea if the factory amp has a subsonic or not, THX does not list ANYTHING on their products.

What's VBoM?
 

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Yes, use the signal going into the amp. I'd be willing to get that the factory amp has a subsonic filter on it. VBoM is Vehicle Build-out Materials.
 

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Do you have MSN at all? I'll PM ya my addy if you do. Do you have any of those schematics handy or know where I can find them? I have no idea what colours the wires would be at the amp and require a bit of help lol.

If I draw signal before the amp that will give me a full stereo sound? Like 20-22k hz or would it still be mono?
 

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It should have a stereo input.
 

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[quote author=Canadian_LX link=topic=169273.msg3595272#msg3595272 date=1270122185]
Would it be for the same with the THX stereo?
[/quote]No, THX is different.

What year is your car? I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish but messing with the THX system is not the same as messing with a standard stereo. You may want to look into getting something like this...
 

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You're right. The signals are summed in the radio, and there is a sub-out on the deck.
 

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[quote author=Milan Premier link=topic=169273.msg3602702#msg3602702 date=1270576432]
[quote author=Canadian_LX link=topic=169273.msg3595272#msg3595272 date=1270122185]
Would it be for the same with the THX stereo?
[/quote]No, THX is different.

What year is your car? I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish but messing with the THX system is not the same as messing with a standard stereo. You may want to look into getting something like this...
[/quote]

I'm trying to add an amp to power two aftermarket subwoofers. The problem with THX is the DSP in the amps. When it detects any distortion in the speakers it will dial back the gain. This means i am limited to keeping the bass at no more than 1/2 way up (IE: 0 or Flat). If i tap the rear sub wires for signal I feel like im losing out because I cant turn it up.

[quote author=Ferendon link=topic=169273.msg3602851#msg3602851 date=1270579831]
You're right. The signals are summed in the radio, and there is a sub-out on the deck.
[/quote]

Summed in the radio? Can you explain this for me? And are you saying the stock THX stereo has a sub-out behind the dash? Are they low-level RCA inputs that go directly to the factory sub amp?

This install has got to be one of most complicated ive ever done lol
 

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[quote author=Canadian_LX link=topic=169273.msg3603289#msg3603289 date=1270598200]
When it detects any distortion in the speakers it will dial back the gain.[/quote]
Not in the speakers but in the amp. It's doing this because distortion eats voice coils. Any processing will be done in the pre-amp section so whatever you add will mostly have the same "distortion sensing" characteristic. The Audio Control Module has a sub output, but I'm looking at a 2010 diagram and not sure if it's the same as your year. For 2010 the VIOLET/GREEN is the sub + and the GREEN/WHITE is the sub -. Those wires are shielded at pin 3. I'd be surprised if Ford used RCA outputs, and they don't need them. However you could get a female RCA and soldier it to those wires which would let you 'tap' into their system. PAC most likely already has one with adjustable outputs on it.
 

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[quote author=Milan Premier link=topic=169273.msg3603459#msg3603459 date=1270603953]
[quote author=Canadian_LX link=topic=169273.msg3603289#msg3603289 date=1270598200]
When it detects any distortion in the speakers it will dial back the gain.[/quote]
Not in the speakers but in the amp. It's doing this because distortion eats voice coils. Any processing will be done in the pre-amp section so whatever you add will mostly have the same "distortion sensing" characteristic. The Audio Control Module has a sub output, but I'm looking at a 2010 diagram and not sure if it's the same as your year. For 2010 the VIOLET/GREEN is the sub + and the GREEN/WHITE is the sub -. Those wires are shielded at pin 3. I'd be surprised if Ford used RCA outputs, and they don't need them. However you could get a female RCA and soldier it to those wires which would let you 'tap' into their system. PAC most likely already has one with adjustable outputs on it.
[/quote]

Where did you find the diagrams? If i disconnect the factory subs will the amp still sense distortion if the bass is turned up? or because there is no driver will it just keep playing?
 

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[quote author=Canadian_LX link=topic=169273.msg3603866#msg3603866 date=1270618556]
Where did you find the diagrams?[/quote]
From Ford.

If i disconnect the factory subs will the amp still sense distortion if the bass is turned up?
Most likely, as this is part of the pre-amp section. The amp however may be monitoring impedance, which a little different.

or because there is no driver will it just keep playing?
Not if you disconnect power... (BROWN/RED)...
 

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[quote author=Milan Premier link=topic=169273.msg3603985#msg3603985 date=1270625109]
Not if you disconnect power... (BROWN/RED)...[/quote]

Is that the main power wire to the factory sub amp? Because if you are correct then that would mean i could tap into the wires BEFORE the amp for signal, then unplug the amp altogether so keep it from sensing distortion which would eliminate my problem yeah??
 
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