FordFusionClub.com banner

21 - 40 of 70 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #21
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4054840#msg4054840 date=1308716482]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4051639#msg4051639 date=1308326641]
Hi,
I have a 2011 Fusion Sport AWD 12k miles. Ever since I got the car (new) I noticed that even when the brake is fully depressed to the floor while driving on a smooth surface, not enough friction was being applied to rotors to cause the ABS system to engage. There should be enough friction to lock the wheels forcing the abs to pump. The only time I can get the abs to engage is on uneven roads, and on snow and ice where the tires have less traction. Emergency stops are downright scary. It feels as tough im applying only 90% pressure when in fact im flooring the pedal. This occurs when pads are cold, warm or hot. I took it to the dealer. The tech drove it with me and agreed that it doesn’t seem right. We then took a new fusion off the lot (was not a sport, but im not sure what version) and it had the same problem. The Toyota yaris I rented was able to stop MUCH better than the fusion. Every other car ive driven including, Accord, Camry, yaris, etc, had enough force to engage abs during a panic stop. Interestingly one of the service writers commented that she noticed that same issue on her husband’s fusion. The tech emailed and is expecting a response by Monday.
This is a serious issue and I was wondering if anyone else is experiencing this?
Thanks
[/quote]

I don't agree at all with your assessment that there is a problem because you could not invoke ABS on clean, dry, even pavement.

My Ford technician training specifically taught that you could not do that with all cars. ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up.

In my own driving experience, I have driven many cars in which the brakes worked properly and the ABS could not be invoked unless the pavement was wet, sandy, or uneven.

I suspect you are suffering from the "Chicken Little" syndrome.
[/quote]
You are wrong. As you stated "ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up", therefore, if the system does not engage upon maximum brake pressure, there is not enough friction between the pads and the rotors. Its simple physics. If the wheels are not being brought to threshold of lockup, then maximum stoping force is not being applied. The car is unsafe. It is not normal. Ive driven countless other cars and the only time i remember experienceing this is with my 94 taurus. It is VERY unsettling when making an emergency stop. The ford tech agreed with me. In my research I have found others complaining about the same problem - skip the first few posts, http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1fbb61/0
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
444 Posts
I did a planned emergency stop at lunch... its raining so I cheated... but the ABS did kick in. Ill have to try it soon when its dry out.

I also HAD to upgrade my pads so my current results might be useless for your purposes.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,833 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4055888#msg4055888 date=1308839827]
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4054840#msg4054840 date=1308716482]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4051639#msg4051639 date=1308326641]
Hi,
I have a 2011 Fusion Sport AWD 12k miles. Ever since I got the car (new) I noticed that even when the brake is fully depressed to the floor while driving on a smooth surface, not enough friction was being applied to rotors to cause the ABS system to engage. There should be enough friction to lock the wheels forcing the abs to pump. The only time I can get the abs to engage is on uneven roads, and on snow and ice where the tires have less traction. Emergency stops are downright scary. It feels as tough im applying only 90% pressure when in fact im flooring the pedal. This occurs when pads are cold, warm or hot. I took it to the dealer. The tech drove it with me and agreed that it doesn’t seem right. We then took a new fusion off the lot (was not a sport, but im not sure what version) and it had the same problem. The Toyota yaris I rented was able to stop MUCH better than the fusion. Every other car ive driven including, Accord, Camry, yaris, etc, had enough force to engage abs during a panic stop. Interestingly one of the service writers commented that she noticed that same issue on her husband’s fusion. The tech emailed and is expecting a response by Monday.
This is a serious issue and I was wondering if anyone else is experiencing this?
Thanks
[/quote]

I don't agree at all with your assessment that there is a problem because you could not invoke ABS on clean, dry, even pavement.

My Ford technician training specifically taught that you could not do that with all cars. ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up.

In my own driving experience, I have driven many cars in which the brakes worked properly and the ABS could not be invoked unless the pavement was wet, sandy, or uneven.

I suspect you are suffering from the "Chicken Little" syndrome.
[/quote]
You are wrong. As you stated "ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up", therefore, if the system does not engage upon maximum brake pressure, there is not enough friction between the pads and the rotors. Its simple physics. If the wheels are not being brought to threshold of lockup, then maximum stoping force is not being applied. The car is unsafe. It is not normal. Ive driven countless other cars and the only time i remember experienceing this is with my 94 taurus. It is VERY unsettling when making an emergency stop. The ford tech agreed with me. In my research I have found others complaining about the same problem - skip the first few posts, http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1fbb61/0
[/quote]

Hi fenderamn. :cheers: Although the Internet and information-age are fantastic, sometimes the worst place to get technical information (or to actually accomplish something, at least) is on public forums.

That being said, if you have a concern about your car, your best bet is usually to address it with the Dealership. If you are not happy with the answers you get at your original Dealership, then try another one. Or follow the conflict resolution process outlined in your Owners Warranty Guide.

In this case, the information Big Jim gave you is 100% correct for a properly working brake system. You simply feel that your brake system is not working properly and since it is not working properly the information does not apply to your situation, which may also be correct.

If I understand correctly, according to your information so far, your Dealer is working to find a solution to your issue, so that is a good thing. It is not as though they denied there is a problem. While I realize this is very important to you, sometimes things don't get fixed as fast as we would like.

This last part is my opinion, so you are free to ignore it as you like: You need to contact your Dealerships Service Department for the latest information. To be honest, debating details over the Internet with people who have not been able to drive or examine your car will get you nothing but a bit of aggravation.

Again, that is only my opinion and I am only trying to help you get through this with the least amount of aggravation possible.

Keep us updated and good luck. :wavey:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #24
[quote author=bbf2530 link=topic=192326.msg4056038#msg4056038 date=1308850461]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4055888#msg4055888 date=1308839827]
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4054840#msg4054840 date=1308716482]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4051639#msg4051639 date=1308326641]
Hi,
I have a 2011 Fusion Sport AWD 12k miles. Ever since I got the car (new) I noticed that even when the brake is fully depressed to the floor while driving on a smooth surface, not enough friction was being applied to rotors to cause the ABS system to engage. There should be enough friction to lock the wheels forcing the abs to pump. The only time I can get the abs to engage is on uneven roads, and on snow and ice where the tires have less traction. Emergency stops are downright scary. It feels as tough im applying only 90% pressure when in fact im flooring the pedal. This occurs when pads are cold, warm or hot. I took it to the dealer. The tech drove it with me and agreed that it doesn’t seem right. We then took a new fusion off the lot (was not a sport, but im not sure what version) and it had the same problem. The Toyota yaris I rented was able to stop MUCH better than the fusion. Every other car ive driven including, Accord, Camry, yaris, etc, had enough force to engage abs during a panic stop. Interestingly one of the service writers commented that she noticed that same issue on her husband’s fusion. The tech emailed and is expecting a response by Monday.
This is a serious issue and I was wondering if anyone else is experiencing this?
Thanks
[/quote]

I don't agree at all with your assessment that there is a problem because you could not invoke ABS on clean, dry, even pavement.

My Ford technician training specifically taught that you could not do that with all cars. ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up.

In my own driving experience, I have driven many cars in which the brakes worked properly and the ABS could not be invoked unless the pavement was wet, sandy, or uneven.

I suspect you are suffering from the "Chicken Little" syndrome.
[/quote]
You are wrong. As you stated "ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up", therefore, if the system does not engage upon maximum brake pressure, there is not enough friction between the pads and the rotors. Its simple physics. If the wheels are not being brought to threshold of lockup, then maximum stoping force is not being applied. The car is unsafe. It is not normal. Ive driven countless other cars and the only time i remember experienceing this is with my 94 taurus. It is VERY unsettling when making an emergency stop. The ford tech agreed with me. In my research I have found others complaining about the same problem - skip the first few posts, http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1fbb61/0
[/quote]

Hi fenderamn. :cheers: Although the Internet and information-age are fantastic, sometimes the worst place to get technical information (or to actually accomplish something, at least) is on public forums.

That being said, if you have a concern about your car, your best bet is usually to address it with the Dealership. If you are not happy with the answers you get at your original Dealership, then try another one. Or follow the conflict resolution process outlined in your Owners Warranty Guide.

In this case, the information Big Jim gave you is 100% correct for a properly working brake system. You simply feel that your brake system is not working properly and since it is not working properly the information does not apply to your situation, which may also be correct.

If I understand correctly, according to your information so far, your Dealer is working to find a solution to your issue, so that is a good thing. It is not as though they denied there is a problem. While I realize this is very important to you, sometimes things don't get fixed as fast as we would like.

This last part is my opinion, so you are free to ignore it as you like: You need to contact your Dealerships Service Department for the latest information. To be honest, debating details over the Internet with people who have not been able to drive or examine your car will get you nothing but a bit of aggravation.

Again, that is only my opinion and I am only trying to help you get through this with the least amount of aggravation possible.

Keep us updated and good luck. :wavey:
[/quote]
Hi,
I really think you are missing my point. I am not using the internet to get technical information. I submitted the link to edmunds only to indicate that others are having the same issue. Most drivers do not test their vehicles to measure the response during panic stops. My car exhibits a serious flaw, in that the stoping distance is excessive because maximum pressure is not being applied to the rotors. It is NOT my imagination. As I have said its noticible and quanitfiable. What is disturbing is that my vehicle is not the only Fusion with this brake issue. The new fusion on the dealer lot acted the same way and others online are reporting the same problem. There is a serious flaw in the way the system was desgined. As I stated earlier, if the wheels do reach the lockup threshold, then by definition, maximum stoping pressure is NOT being applied. Unless Ford technical training manuals can rewrite the laws of physics, there is either a design or manufacturing defect on these fusions. As of yet my dealer has not heard back from ford.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,833 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4056273#msg4056273 date=1308861403]

Hi,
I really think you are missing my point. I am not using the internet to get technical information. I submitted the link to edmunds only to indicate that others are having the same issue. Most drivers do not test their vehicles to measure the response during panic stops. My car exhibits a serious flaw, in that the stoping distance is excessive because maximum pressure is not being applied to the rotors. It is NOT my imagination. As I have said its noticible and quanitfiable. What is disturbing is that my vehicle is not the only Fusion with this brake issue. The new fusion on the dealer lot acted the same way and others online are reporting the same problem. There is a serious flaw in the way the system was desgined. As I stated earlier, if the wheels do reach the lockup threshold, then by definition, maximum stoping pressure is NOT being applied. Unless Ford technical training manuals can rewrite the laws of physics, there is either a design or manufacturing defect on these fusions. As of yet my dealer has not heard back from ford.
[/quote]

Hi fenderman. :wavey: I was afraid this would be the outcome of getting involved in this thread. :bash: Politely and with all due respect, no I did not miss your point but you certainly misunderstood mine. And if you would please read my reply again with an open mind, I certainly said nothing to imply it was your "imagination", so there is no need to imply that I did. You are a new member of the FFC so we can't expect you to realize this, so I will just mention that many FFC members here (and most who replied in this thread) are longtime FFC members who are well aware of the issues that affect our vehicles. It is helpful that you helped by including a link, but it is not news to most FFC members that a percentage of owners will complain of brake issues (as in any vehicle).

And in reality, a more accurate quote of what I previously stated is "...sometimes the worst place to get technical information (or to actually accomplish something, at least) is on public forums". That more accurate quote completely changes the meaning of what I stated in my previous reply. Nevertheless, when I stated that I was attempting to be diplomatic. So let me put it this way: To seek helpful advice with your type of issue over the Internet is pointless. What we can do to help is limited. If you are simply blowing off steam, that is your right. Then tell us you are just blowing off steam and we can all let you do it in peace. But to expect much more than general advice and then become defensive and parse words (or quote people out of context) is a bit unfair. Please don't shoot the innocent messengers (that would be us who are trying to help you). :dunno:

We are trying to help you to the best of our ability (although we can not drive or see your car), but that ability is extremely limited and you are becoming defensive for no particular reason. I understand you truly feel there is an issue with your Fusions brakes and I am not saying there is not. However, debating what we can not see or feel is pointless. I can tell you that if my car had a brake problem, I would not be arguing the point on this or any other Internet forum, I would be following it up with my Dealer and contacting Ford directly.

There is a well defined dispute resolution process in place when a customer is displeased with their car, its performance or the service they receive. It is clearly outlined in the Owners Warranty Guide. You state that your car has a serious safety issue and I am not arguing the point. You can either follow up with your Dealers Service Department and Ford to put that procedure into action, or you can debate things with strangers who can not drive, examine, diagnose or repair your car. It is up to you which you think will get your car fixed quicker.

As stated, if you only want to blow off steam until your brake issue is corrected, just say so and we will let you do so in peace.

Keep us updated and good luck. :cheers:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #26
I am not blowing off steam. The forums are designed so that drivers may share experiences. This is helpful because others may be experiencing similar issue and can share information. I just spoke with the dealership and they indicated that ford does not have a fix for the problem and they deem it "normal". This is not the case. The car is a hazard. I want to publicize the issue so that others may test their vehicles, and if they experience the same problem they may file complaints with the NHTSA so that Ford implements a proper fix. I will follow up with ford however i will not remain silent on the issue. I will keep posting until this is resolved.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,833 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4056309#msg4056309 date=1308865666]
I am not blowing off steam. The forums are designed so that drivers may share experiences. This is helpful because others may be experiencing similar issue and can share information. I just spoke with the dealership and they indicated that ford does not have a fix for the problem and they deem it "normal". This is not the case. The car is a hazard. I want to publicize the issue so that others may test their vehicles, and if they experience the same problem they may file complaints with the NHTSA so that Ford implements a proper fix. I will follow up with ford however i will not remain silent on the issue. I will keep posting until this is resolved.
[/quote]

Hi fenderman. :wavey: No one is asking you to remain silent, nor did anyone imply that you should. I am simply pointing out that your battle is not with the FFC members who are trying to help you.

Good luck in your quest. :cheers:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #28
Hi,
I will be contacting ford when they open tomorrow. Thinking about the weak brake pressure reminded me about the toyota accellerator issue. I recall toyota and gm (probably all others) stating that the brake system has enough force to stop the vehicle even at wide open throtle (given that they are not over heated). See this car and driver article where they performed a test from 70mph -

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/09q4/how_to_deal_with_unintended_acceleration-tech_dept

So in a large parking lot on my way home from work, I came to a complete stop. I then applied maximum brake force and proceded to floor the gas pedal. My car accelerated to over 15mph and given more room would have gone faster. After the brakes cooled I tried on an open road traveling 20MPH I repeated the test, flooring both the brake and accelerator the car easily kept accelerating. I recall reading that there is a regulation that requires that the braking system have enough force to overpower engine, does anyone know where I could find that? Thanks
Something is very very wrong here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
682 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4055888#msg4055888 date=1308839827]
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4054840#msg4054840 date=1308716482]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4051639#msg4051639 date=1308326641]
Hi,
I have a 2011 Fusion Sport AWD 12k miles. Ever since I got the car (new) I noticed that even when the brake is fully depressed to the floor while driving on a smooth surface, not enough friction was being applied to rotors to cause the ABS system to engage. There should be enough friction to lock the wheels forcing the abs to pump. The only time I can get the abs to engage is on uneven roads, and on snow and ice where the tires have less traction. Emergency stops are downright scary. It feels as tough im applying only 90% pressure when in fact im flooring the pedal. This occurs when pads are cold, warm or hot. I took it to the dealer. The tech drove it with me and agreed that it doesn’t seem right. We then took a new fusion off the lot (was not a sport, but im not sure what version) and it had the same problem. The Toyota yaris I rented was able to stop MUCH better than the fusion. Every other car ive driven including, Accord, Camry, yaris, etc, had enough force to engage abs during a panic stop. Interestingly one of the service writers commented that she noticed that same issue on her husband’s fusion. The tech emailed and is expecting a response by Monday.
This is a serious issue and I was wondering if anyone else is experiencing this?
Thanks
[/quote]

I don't agree at all with your assessment that there is a problem because you could not invoke ABS on clean, dry, even pavement.

My Ford technician training specifically taught that you could not do that with all cars. ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up.

In my own driving experience, I have driven many cars in which the brakes worked properly and the ABS could not be invoked unless the pavement was wet, sandy, or uneven.

I suspect you are suffering from the "Chicken Little" syndrome.
[/quote]
You are wrong. As you stated "ABS is intended to function only when the brakes are right on the threshold of lock-up", therefore, if the system does not engage upon maximum brake pressure, there is not enough friction between the pads and the rotors. Its simple physics. If the wheels are not being brought to threshold of lockup, then maximum stoping force is not being applied. The car is unsafe. It is not normal. Ive driven countless other cars and the only time i remember experienceing this is with my 94 taurus. It is VERY unsettling when making an emergency stop. The ford tech agreed with me. In my research I have found others complaining about the same problem - skip the first few posts, http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f1fbb61/0
[/quote]

Just for the record, I'm not saying you don't have a problem. Without road testing your car I cannot tell. What I am saying is that your test criteria of not being able to invoke the ABS is not a valid test.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #30
its a very valid test. Again its simple physics. if the wheel is not at the threshold of lockup, maximum brake force is not being applied. If you can explain otherwise I would welcome it. Additionally as my last post indicated, the brakes are so weak that they will not hold the car from a stopped position when full acceleration is applied, while a camry will stop easy from 70mph with wide open throttle. Not normal, sorry.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
682 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4056534#msg4056534 date=1308888025]
its a very valid test. Again its simple physics. if the wheel is not at the threshold of lockup, maximum brake force is not being applied. If you can explain otherwise I would welcome it. Additionally as my last post indicated, the brakes are so weak that they will not hold the car from a stopped position when full acceleration is applied, while a camry will stop easy from 70mph with wide open throttle. Not normal, sorry.
[/quote]

I'm trying not to get insulting but your not making it easy.

As I said before I cannot tell if your car is normal until I drive it. So what is there to be sorry about?

As for your assessment of ABS operation, it doesn't agree with my extensive training or experience. I feel no need to explain your misunderstanding of the physics involved. You can accept or reject my perspective, based on probably more years of experience than you are old.

There are some that are willing to learn form other's experience, There are others that must go through the experience for themselves, wasting a lot of time. It's your choice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #32
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4057704#msg4057704 date=1309031674]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4056534#msg4056534 date=1308888025]
its a very valid test. Again its simple physics. if the wheel is not at the threshold of lockup, maximum brake force is not being applied. If you can explain otherwise I would welcome it. Additionally as my last post indicated, the brakes are so weak that they will not hold the car from a stopped position when full acceleration is applied, while a camry will stop easy from 70mph with wide open throttle. Not normal, sorry.
[/quote]

I'm trying not to get insulting but your not making it easy.

As I said before I cannot tell if your car is normal until I drive it. So what is there to be sorry about?

As for your assessment of ABS operation, it doesn't agree with my extensive training or experience. I feel no need to explain your misunderstanding of the physics involved. You can accept or reject my perspective, based on probably more years of experience than you are old.

There are some that are willing to learn form other's experience, There are others that must go through the experience for themselves, wasting a lot of time. It's your choice.
[/quote]
Dude, you are soooo full of it.
1) backhanded insult.
2) You work for Ford and clearly have an ulterior motive.
3)You talk about your "extensive experience" but don't back up your statements with explaining the physics. Either do it or stop shilling for ford. Two techs have driven my car and agree something is wrong. If you have so much training and experience then PLEASE EXPLAIN THE PHYSICS TO ME. PLEASE IM BEGGING.
4)You do NOT need to drive my car to answer this question " should my car be able to hold steady when full brake and accelerator are applied simultaneously? YES OR NO
5) I have had an in dependant mechanic drive my car and tell me something is wrong.
I do not need your silly shilling to tell me that its "normal". Two techs have already driven the car admitted that there is an issue but all the fusion have the issue so ford deems it normal. Additionally they told me that many others have complained. Clearly there is a design defect here. You may not want to admit it "until YOU drive the car" but its there, others see it and feel it. Again its not just how the brakes feel, its a quantifiable stoping distance increase.
A regional ford rep will be looking at my car next week. If he doesn't resolve my issue, i will keep on until something is done.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
682 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4057716#msg4057716 date=1309033039]
[quote author=Big Jim link=topic=192326.msg4057704#msg4057704 date=1309031674]
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4056534#msg4056534 date=1308888025]
its a very valid test. Again its simple physics. if the wheel is not at the threshold of lockup, maximum brake force is not being applied. If you can explain otherwise I would welcome it. Additionally as my last post indicated, the brakes are so weak that they will not hold the car from a stopped position when full acceleration is applied, while a camry will stop easy from 70mph with wide open throttle. Not normal, sorry.
[/quote]

I'm trying not to get insulting but your not making it easy.

As I said before I cannot tell if your car is normal until I drive it. So what is there to be sorry about?

As for your assessment of ABS operation, it doesn't agree with my extensive training or experience. I feel no need to explain your misunderstanding of the physics involved. You can accept or reject my perspective, based on probably more years of experience than you are old.

There are some that are willing to learn form other's experience, There are others that must go through the experience for themselves, wasting a lot of time. It's your choice.
[/quote]
Dude, you are soooo full of it.
1) backhanded insult.
2) You work for Ford and clearly have an ulterior motive.
3)You talk about your "extensive experience" but don't back up your statements with explaining the physics. Either do it or stop shilling for ford. Two techs have driven my car and agree something is wrong. If you have so much training and experience then PLEASE EXPLAIN THE PHYSICS TO ME. PLEASE IM BEGGING.
4)You do NOT need to drive my car to answer this question " should my car be able to hold steady when full brake and accelerator are applied simultaneously? YES OR NO
5) I have had an in dependant mechanic drive my car and tell me something is wrong.
I do not need your silly shilling to tell me that its "normal". Two techs have already driven the car admitted that there is an issue but all the fusion have the issue so ford deems it normal. Additionally they told me that many others have complained. Clearly there is a design defect here. You may not want to admit it "until YOU drive the car" but its there, others see it and feel it. Again its not just how the brakes feel, its a quantifiable stoping distance increase.
A regional ford rep will be looking at my car next week. If he doesn't resolve my issue, i will keep on until something is done.
[/quote]

I don't work for Ford. I worked for several Ford dealers and other makes as well. What do you need to show my level of competency? My Ford training log? My (now expired) ASE Master Technician Certificate?

The comment I responded to was your misunderstanding about how ABS functions. One that you are determined to hang on to. NOT ALL CARS ARE DESIGNED SO THAT YOU CAN INVOKE THE ABS ON DRY CLEAN PAVEMENT!

Once again, I cannot tell you if your car is normal or not without driving it. I learned long ago not to take the word of another technician as to what is wrong with a car.

Are you working with the dealership to find a fix? You are far more likely to get to a resolution through Ford channels than you will from an independent mechanic. I'm not saying which is better, the dealership technician or an independent mechanic, because there are good and bad in both groups, but the independents don't have factory resources to resolve sticky problems.

ABS is pretty simple. When the system senses that a wheel is decelerating more rapidly than the car is, it releases the brakes on that wheel. Next it reapplies the brakes. It reacts so rapidly that the on / off cycle is many times a second. While this is happening, the brake pedal vibrates as a result of the on / off cycling. On many cars, a strong rumble noise is made while ABS is invoked. Letting off on the brake pedal stops the ABS action, but also stops braking action.

The key here is that abs does not invoke until the system senses that the wheel is stopping faster than the car is, AND THAT DOES NOT HAPPEN ON ALL CARS ON EVERY PANIC STOP. In fact, it is a goal of brake engineers to design the brake system so that it is not likely to lock up the wheels on a panic stop with or without ABS.

So get your knickers unknotted and start acting like the adult this group is trying to treat you like.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,833 Posts
EDIT - Well, as has happened in the past, I began composing a reply while someone else has posted (in this case, Big Jim). That means I had not seen/read that post before I posted below. Nevertheless, what I stated below still applies.


Hi fenderman. This is your warning, as your posts are now becoming argumentative and bordering on the trollish.

You no longer seem to be here to seek advice, assistance or opinions (unless they agree with you). That means you are here more for the sake of publicizing your dissatisfaction and complaining about your car (a.k.a. blowing off steam as previously mentioned). That is perfectly fine and allowable. But as previously mentioned, then make it clear you don't want others opinions and everyone can leave you alone in your misery.

You very well may be correct about your car, or perhaps you are incorrect. We can't make that decision over the Internet. All we can do is listen to your complaints and try to give helpful advice, which you are obviously not appreciative of. Whether Big Jim is a Ford Employee or not (also keeping in mind that even Ford Dealership Employees are not Ford Employees) is beside the point, as he has not "shilled" for Ford in the past and is not now. What we can tell you he is, is a long time, well respected, informative and helpful member of the FFC. Since you are new here, you can not be expected to know that and we have and will allowed you a certain but limited amount of latitude. But you are treading the line now.

I will inform you that I am not a Ford Employee. In addition, if the posts in this thread continue to be needlessly argumentative or continue on towards the abusive, appropriate steps will be taken. In that vein, choose your words very carefully before posting again, as you have received a clear warning.

Now, back to your brake issue: You state that Ford has looked at the car and a Regional rep will now be examining the car. So Ford is still involved and is actively trying to assist you. Well, you just keep us updated on that. Hopefully things will work out to your satisfaction. If it does not (again, we all hope it does), then follow the dispute resolution procedures that are outlined in your Warranty Guide which we mentioned previously.

Again, keep us updated and good luck. :cheers:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #35
I do want others opinions. Big Jim is just touting his experience without backing up his statements. I want others with this issue to come across this posting. As I have said im not the only one with this issue. What line am i treading exacly. All i have asked is that big jim back up his statements.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,833 Posts
[quote author=fenderman link=topic=192326.msg4057732#msg4057732 date=1309035904]
I do want others opinions. Big Jim is just touting his experience without backing up his statements. I want others with this issue to come across this posting. As I have said im not the only one with this issue. What line am i treading exacly. All i have asked is that big jim back up his statements.
[/quote]

Hi fenderman. :wavey: I made it clear in my previous reply, but since you are new here (as also mentioned) I will give you the benefit of the doubt. Your posts have become needlessly argumentative and bordering on the trollish (due to certain comparisons obviously meant to "stir the pot"). The opinions you seek seem to be only those that agree with yours. And again, no one has stated that you are incorrect concerning your car, we just can't tell how your car is operating over the Internet. Oddly enough, we have seen behavior eerily similar to this in the past, from a certain now banned ex-member. Eerily similar. :dunno:

Whether you like it or not, there is no way to back up "statements of experience" over the Internet, other than to provide correct information. No one is going to copy and paste their credentials. When/if you are here long enough, you will learn who you can count on to provides solid information in all sorts of automotive areas. We have experts (or those who can provide near expert information) in all sorts of areas of expertise. A lot of helpful members are willing to assist others, if they are treated with a minimum of respect.

If you are only taking a poll of those who have similar concerns to yours ("I want others with this issue to come across this posting."), then make it clear that you are essentially taking a poll and would prefer that others do not express facts or opinions contrary to yours. Then only those who feel they are experiencing what you are will reply and the rest of us will try not to bother you.

Until then, keep it adult and civil.

Good luck. :cheers:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #37
I am keeping it civil. I reported a problem with my vehicle brakes. Some said their cars are fine. Others responded that they are experiencing similar issues. Great. Then along comes a poster and says its normal. Now all I ask is that he explain why its normal. He has not to date given any explanation other than his techincal training says so. I did not ask for his credentials. All I requested was for him to explain to me how he came to his conclusion. I am not venting, just trying to get to the bottom of this. If everyone on this forum would just wait and see what ford has to say - there would be not point to the forum at all.

I can assure you that I have not been a member of this board under any other screen name. I leased my fusion on september of 2010 and my last ford was a 94 taurus.

I hope to have further updates on the brake issue this week.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
764 Posts
wow. that escalated rather quickly haha

any news on this fenderman? as you stated, with something so dire to you, id have expected some sort of response to this.

unless the worst has happened and you wrecked the car cause of this. lets hope thats not why theres been no response.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #39
[quote author=dick.breakey link=topic=192326.msg4068761#msg4068761 date=1310421908]
wow. that escalated rather quickly haha

any news on this fenderman? as you stated, with something so dire to you, id have expected some sort of response to this.

unless the worst has happened and you wrecked the car cause of this. lets hope thats not why theres been no response.
[/quote]
Hey,
Thanks for the concern breakey. I am fine (so far). For the past couple of weeks my dealer has been promising a meeting with a Ford rep, but not coming through. I will attempt one more call tomorrow. As far as i can tell i am left with three options.

1)send ouford a demand letter for repair and if they refuse, go to lemon law arbitration. A person I found on another forum, with the EXACT same issue with his 2010 fusion, claims he was successful in getting his vehicle repurchased by ford through the lemon law in his state.

2) Sue ford in superior court (NJ).

3) Try to throw semi-metalic pads and new rotors on there and see if it helps. I have found that drivers of other vehicles with this issue have been able to resolve it with a change of pad - usually a semi-metalic pad, as they have more bite than the ceramics albeit with more dust. I could care less about the dust though. I will probably do this first as it seems to be the quickest option and may solve my issue.

I have been really patient with them but ford does not seem to care at all. Like I said, I have been able to find others with the problem but no solution yet. I will post any new developments.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
764 Posts
id definitely go with the cheaper and easier option first. but good to know your ok haha


and side note. whi is ITO the only one whos not afraid to call me Dick haha. its my damn name
 
21 - 40 of 70 Posts
Top